Teresa: Hello friends, and welcome to the Doing What Matters podcast. I’m your host, Teresa McCoy. As we dive into discussion today about life and business and all the things that truly matter, we always want to embrace a holistic approach to a way of life that’s rooted in rest, not rush. It’s about connecting to our real self, our real life, and our real work and remembering who God uniquely created us to be. Redefining success through a different lens. So whether you’re here to find inspiration, practical advice, or just a moment of connection, we are so glad you’re here.

And I say “we” today, because I am thrilled to have a new friend of mine on the podcast today. Dr. Richelle, welcome to the podcast. I am thrilled to have you and to just be able to share some of the work that you do. So what would be important for us to know today about?

Dr. Richelle: Well, thank you for such a warm welcome. I’m just loving being a REALIFE Process Coach and having gotten to know you and the rest of the community. I guess what I want people to know is what a beautiful life we have when we truly embrace living from that rest and not rush, which is something I’ve been learning myself over the last several years. So this process just fits right in with who I am.

Teresa: It does for sure. And you’ve had a coaching practice for a while. I’ve just enjoyed so much getting to know you and getting to know some of your story. I’d really like to dive in and have you share some of that. What got you here? What’s some of the backstory that got you to this coaching business?

Dr. Richelle: So I’m going to go back a little bit to how I got into the business. In 2017, God called me away from a much loved career that I had been in for 17 years. I was working in higher education first as a college instructor, and then I morphed into counseling, which was a great fit because my career started as a clinical psychologist. I had been in practice for about a decade when God called me away from a successful private practice into higher education.

And then here I am, approaching 2017. And He says, “I think it’s time for something new.” I wasn’t quite ready honestly, but I took an early retirement to start my business, initially called Crossroads Renewal Coaching and Counseling. I knew at that time I was being called to reach people navigating tough seasons, at a crossroads. I also realized that this is where the crossroads renewal came in meeting people “at their crossroads” (Jeremiah 6: 16) and “to help them renew their minds” (Romans 12:2) And so I was armed with this idea that I was going to help people — take them from their crossroads to living life as God intended for them.

So what’s their purpose? What are they here for? I had initially become a Certified Dream Builder Coach. I was kind of using some of that content, but very quickly realized that people needed a clear idea of their identity. Who are you? What are you here for? To get to a dream, you have to be informed by how you’re wired. And so that is where I began. I created a program that is called Abundant Purpose. In that process, I help people figure out who they’re here to be.

And, so here I am. I’m doing this, and, you know, started off this business in 2017 and I hit the ground running like I always did. I like to be an achiever, but I’m going to tell you, I was scared to death. I had no idea how to do a business. And I was like, “God, you gotta be kidding me. I told you I do anything in the world for you, but don’t make me run my own business.” Well, here I am. He called me to that.

And so I forgot along the way that He called me to it, meaning that if He calls you, He equips you. So I went running full speed ahead and left him somewhere in the background. I was going like a mad woman, 24/7. It’s all I could think about is like: How am I going to be successful? I was so afraid to fail. I thought I left this business or this career that I had, that I loved, that I got a paycheck for, I didn’t have to go find clients, all that stuff, I could just simply show up and do what I do, but here I am in a business doing, my passion, but there’s the other side of that. How do you make that sustainable over time? By the time I would say a good two and a half years, into that whole business I had clients and I was seeing people and I was doing all the things that we do to just start and establish a business.

But I crashed by the end of 2019. It was so bad, Teresa, that at that point, I literally questioned my value and worth of why I was even here. I don’t want to say that I was at the point of suicidal planning, but I sure had some thoughts about life would be a lot easier not being here. That’s how dark it got to the point that I even lost my sense that God was with me in it. The world became so dark and in that moment, thankfully, I had some very, beloved spiritual friends who rescued me, prayed over me.

And the very next day I had a revelation from God Himself, and He pointed me to something that I read that I don’t know how as walking with Jesus for as long as I have, how I missed this message of grace. But He showed me that what I was doing was I was grinding myself to the core and I was depleted. All I needed to do was to come under His grace. He’d already done the work. I was running around coming from rush. And all I needed to do was go back to Him and say, “Look, I already approved of you. You’re not doing this to prove anything to me. I’m calling you to serve out of your gifts, but you don’t have to be running. Let’s walk. Let’s rest. Let’s take a nap here and there.”

And so ultimately, He actually had me change my business name. And so this kind of unfolded over several months. But here we are when COVID season hit. Now, it’s 2020. It’s May. And I’m reading all of these things on social media. People are out of their minds. They’re fearful. They’re angry. You know, all that stuff you remember. And I remember feeling this very strong impression from the Lord. He said to me, “I want you to reach out to these people and I want you to do it this way.” He was calling me to put out five days of videos of my best content of how to rise with resiliency through those challenging times. I thought, okay, how am I gonna do this? I’d never done anything like this before. I don’t feel comfortable doing this on social media. But then he calls me to go live and invite people to listen to the videos.

I remember the first time I did that, I was sweating so profusely. But at any rate, that very first day I released my video, I had invited people. I said, “Hey, if you think this would be helpful, just sign up. I’m gonna send you something free, which was actually a guide from Tom Ziglar, Stronger Mindset. I sent that guide because I’m a Ziglar Legacy Certified Coach and Trainer.

I had 13 people that first day, Teresa. By the fifth day, because every day I released videos Monday to Friday, it was over 800. People. Crazy. And this is not Richelle. That was God. But this is what I was seeing: people need community and they need encouragement. And so I said to Him at that point, “Okay, so what do I do? I’ve got 800 people showing up.” He says, “Keep going.” And what I’ve settled into was mostly daily posting of quotes that inspired me that would inspire a reflection tool or tip to help them create a more abundant mindset.

As God was moving through my life in that season and going back to when I had the crash, He pointed me to John 10:10. What He had shown me is that the enemy, the thief, would have come to kill, steal, and destroy my purpose. Life got dark. And He said, “But I, Jesus, have come to give you the full abundant life.”

And that life is ushered in through grace. He says, “Listen, yes, you’re still meeting people at those crossroads to help renew their minds. But I want you to be about pointing people to the abundant life and abundant business. And so it was at that point that everything shifted to Dr. Richelle, Abundant Life and Business. It’s who I am. And it’s reflecting and it embodies my full passion and desire to help people uncover and discover what it means for them specifically. How do you live out that life of yours, that beautiful life abundantly? So that’s, that’s kind of that story that got me a beautiful journey.

Teresa: And I love, just thank you for sharing that because I know there are people listening to this episode that can relate. That can relate to that place of I have been grinding for a long time. For some people, they may be feeling something, and maybe that word “grinding” resonates with them heavily. But what did that look like? What were some behaviors? What were some things that were going on when you’re grinding? What does it look like? Cause sometimes we can’t name it. So can you give us some examples of what was going on?

Dr. Richelle: Absolutely. So for me, coming from that place of rush, I constantly felt like I was behind. Like there were other people, other coaches out there, they’ve been doing it longer. They’re doing it better. They know more. I remember feeling so inadequate. As a result, I thought I don’t have enough in myself. That means I’ve got to catch up. I got to learn how to market. I got to learn how to put together programs. I have to learn how to get on social media. All these things, that sense of being behind, was this internal pressure that really at the root of this, Teresa, was this belief: I’m not enough.

When you believe that, you start clawing at everything. I was clawing at buying programs and marketing and all these things. And in the meantime, I’m trying to maintain a case loader, a coaching load, build business and do all that. Rush and grind meant sleeping very little. Even if I was in a conversation with a family member or on, on the weekend, I could not turn it off. It was on my mind.

Teresa: I appreciate you sharing what it looks like because sometimes, we can notice and feel things and say things like, “Oh, I’m not enough. I’m not cut out for this. I shouldn’t do this.” For you to tell us what those look like and what you were doing, just take some inventory if you’re listening, “Is that what I’m saying to myself right now? Is that what I’m doing this? I feel behind all the time. I don’t have enough. I don’t know enough. I need to buy some more things because the next thing I buy will be the magic bullet. If I learn how to make videos, if I learn how to do so much of that” is really the kill and destroy. It’s coming to steal your joy of why you began if you’re in coaching, or even if you’re just a business owner and it’s different for you because of the industry you’re in that you’re feeling the hustle that no matter what I do, someone else is always doing it better. And so I love that you named exactly that I wasn’t sleeping much. Because those are all, we all live out those behaviors differently. But when we can say them, and I did a podcast probably four or five months ago about I relapsed, so I know myself well enough to know that when I get to certain behaviors, that means I’m going to the dark side, or that I, relapse, so to speak, and I’m in that. So the fact that, yeah, that you had friends that came around you.

Dr. Richelle: Yes. And truly, when I think about some of the other behaviors, I rarely got out of my seat. I was sitting in front of a computer for hours on end. Isn’t that true? If I was going to read anything, which is one of my renewal activities, it was all business related. I could never give myself that break. But again, it was, as you said, it was stealing my joy of why I was doing this to begin with. And it became about performance.

When Jesus reintroduced me to, I mean, it’s not like that was the first time I’d heard the verse, it’s just the first time it really hit my heart in such a powerful way. Then He said, “Listen, you can rest in My grace. I’m here to give you the abundant life, meaning your life is going to be full of significance and purpose. But if you never did another thing, if you never saw another client, if you never made another dollar, I still love you. Yeah, I’m still with you. And you still have purpose.” And I had to get that in my heart.

Teresa: When we get to that place, where we have to surrender that God, do you love me no matter what? Will you love me if I never perform? If I never make another dollar? If I failed as a parent? Will you still love me? And when He says yes, and we can accept that grace, we start building our life back up from a different place. It might even be a name change, right? It might even be a business change. We see that even in scripture where somebody’s name literally changed when God had a different purpose and plan for their life. He did that in your business as well.

I want you to share a little bit of what you discovered as you started from this new place to work with people, helping them find their purpose. Find how they live abundantly. What did you discover about some healing and some different things that a lot of people had to walk through? Cause I know that’s a passionate piece of work for you. So share with us more about that part now we’re in this new season and we’re working with people.

Dr. Richelle: Yeah. I think one of the first things I did, I had a visual of something and I worked with a graphic artist to help me create something called the path of abundant living. And on that path of abundant living, I was describing, “what am I trying to help people achieve?” I want them to live out of grace on mission. Moving toward their vision with growth and in the fruits of the Spirit, so that we continue to evolve.

And it’s like, okay, so what gets us off the path? What keeps us off the path? And so that’s where I was beginning to see “So what’s causing people to be a crossroads?” And I’m going to tell you, almost all the time, it’s a loss. I’m not talking about just death. I mean, that’s the one that usually comes to mind. We think about loss or grief, but there’s loss of what I have lost.

I had not, this is what, this is the truth, Teresa. That crash in 2019 went back to the fact I had unresolved grief about leaving the career I loved. And so how did I deal with that loss way? The way a lot of us do it. They’re called short-term energy relieving behaviors (STERB). One of those can be frenetic activity, workaholism, staying so busy, work is bad or saying “active isn’t a bad thing.” But when we do it repeatedly to avoid feeling an uncomfortable feeling, then that becomes a STERB. And that’s just the way we’re covering up a deeper pain that needs some healing.

Teresa: Okay, you have to pause for me right here. We have to go back to this word, STERB. S T E R B. Interesting, it sounds like disturb, right? Like, right. I’m like, yeah, I, I experienced STERB, but that’s for sure. To say again, what that stands for, because I think for our listeners, for those listening in, that’s going to be a real aha moment and the piece about loss is not always a death experience, although that is one of the ways that we experience loss, so STERB, give us that again.

Dr. Richelle: STERB stands for short-term energy relieving behaviors. Let me mention some typical ones. Food. You know, when we’re kids, sometimes you come home and you’re crying and the kids were mean to me. Mom says, here, have a cookie. This will make you feel better. Yeah, it makes you feel better in the moment, but it doesn’t take care of that deeper wound of rejection. Alcohol, drugs, vaping, smoking, exercise.

Teresa: These behaviors are anything because you named – workaholism and those that have listened to the podcast know that’s my vice. That’s my thing to stay busy, to stay productive because we all get the accolades for that, especially here in our culture in the United States. It’s the badge of honor. So STERB is anything that we almost overgo on.

Dr. Richelle: They’re so prevalent. I mean, let’s have a glass of wine. Let’s scroll through Facebook, and it’s not to shame anybody. This is not shaming. We have not been taught how to manage difficult emotions to begin with. And we certainly as a culture don’t really know how to grieve well, we just don’t have the information. So one of the things people say, oftentimes you just need to stay busy. Just, forget about it, distract yourself. So is distraction always a bad thing? No, but when it is the patterned response to how I manage an uncomfortable feeling, then it becomes something that could lead to greater pain because now we start getting into these patterned responses that can become addictive, right?

Teresa: And it’s not, it’s not the time heal thing either. Cause we hear that, right?

Dr. Richelle: Oh, could I talk about that one with you? That is such a huge one. This business “time heals all wounds.” I think about if I could give you a story. I’m going to tell you a story about a little girl. Her name is Sally. She’s five years old just starting school and she comes home and tells her mom that the kids are being mean to her at school. Now she comes home, tells her mom, this is one of her wounds. Think of it this way. Everybody comes into life with a invisible backpack. And for every wound that we have that does not get healed it’s like a pebble, rock, or boulder that gets tossed in that backpack.

So, little girl Sally’s got that, that pebble that she’s first wanting to explain or express with mom. Mom’s distracted because mom — they’re going through a divorce. So dad’s already moved out. Um, so here’s another rock that’s going into Sally’s backpack. Mom isn’t emotionally available. Another one is her, her dad moved out and parents are going through divorce. By the way, they had to give away the family dog because mom just doesn’t have capacity to take care of the animal. One of the things that is probably leading to the divorce of mom and dad is that Sally’s older brother was killed in a car accident three years earlier. There’s five rocks.

Teresa: They’re all real life. You know what I’m saying? Life happening to people.

Dr. Richelle: Right? And not to mention the other things that can happen. I mean, these are just normal. And I don’t say normal, but there’s things that happen in everyday life. But these are losses. Even if you think about when we take a bottle away from a baby. Of course, that’s what we have to do, but that’s a loss for them at that moment. It’s something they cherish. It’s not something they’re ready to let go of. So loss always represents the ending of something we cherish or that’s something that has brought comfort.

Teresa: I have a 17 month old grandson and last night as we were eating dinner, he has this habit of holding something in his hand. It could be a cracker. It could be a Cheeto. It could be a plastic toy, but he always has something in his hand almost all the time. When you take that away, as I tried to do last night at dinner, it’s tragedy for him. My daughter and I were kind of laughing, kind of not, last night about, I wonder what it is about that need to have something in his hand at 17…18 months old that has become a part of like how his brain, that if you take that and I do, because now as I’ve studied more and more of that stuff and have these kinds of conversations, I’m always looking at those things going, I wonder what’s going on there. I wonder how that is forming. Cause what you’re talking about is formation, right. In our stories and how these things are forming us.

We do a lot of work here, at the REALIFE Process with life story work. I’m putting dots on our map and saying, whether it’s losses, whether it’s joys, but it’s this idea that all throughout life, we’re having these moments. That are putting rocks in our backpacks. That are emotional things. But when you say the word grief, which I know is a word that you work with and that you work in, we kind of categorize that into one place, which is loss of someone we love; whereas grief, and I’ve learned this in my own life, is so many losses. It may have nothing to do with the loss of a person. Could be a career change, could be a move to a different town. So many ways that you could say loss.

Dr. Richelle: In the Grief Recovery Method, which I’m a specialist in, one of our definitions, we say it’s the normal and natural response to a loss of any kind. Here’s the thing, normal and natural, but our culture acts like loss is anything but normal or natural. So we go underground, we want to suppress those feelings.

Another definition I think that gets at exactly what your example was, is that it’s the conflicting feelings that are caused by the end of or a change in a familiar pattern of behavior. Remember when I said I kind of crashed after, I retired. I was in this business. I remember 30 days after my last day of employment at the college, my husband and I were both working at that college, he got in the car, drove to work and I sat at home and bawled my eyes out.

Now, that’s a conflicting emotion. Was I excited about this new opportunity to start this new business? Absolutely. But I was also feeling the pain of the familiar of my friends at work, the knowing what I was doing, knowing I was going to get a paycheck. So think about grief is whenever we end those kinds of things. That’s why there’s more than 40 different life events that can produce a feeling of grief.

Teresa: You and I talked right before we started recording, I’m leaving on sabbatical, right. And we were laughing about it and I’m very purposely choosing to go, knowing that my body needs, that my mind needs that, I’ve had the business for seven years. Maybe seven years ago that we locked our son to addiction. And I’m just recognizing, I lost my best friend two years ago on Christmas to bone cancer. And I’m sitting in knowing that there’s still more to process. I need the time and the space. So there’s a part of me that’s longing, but then there’s part of me that just told a friend that walked out the door earlier from my office. And I said, she goes, “Oh, enjoy. I’m not going to bother you.” I go. “No, no, I still need my friends. Like, don’t, don’t leave” like you’re saying about him driving off to work. So we’re going through these things all the time. They’re part of it.

So say more about, you mentioned it briefly, I want to come back around it. Say more about the grief work specifically, how you’re trained to walk with people. Now that we know that grief is the natural and normal response to a loss of any kind.

Dr. Richelle: So if I could go back to that example of Sally and she’s 5 years old and she encountered those things in her backpack and let’s just say she just moves on with her life and does life the best she can. And now she’s 30, and as a 30 year old, she hadn’t emptied out her backpack. So she’s got those five things. We already talked about loss of dog, parents going through divorce, bullying. Guess what? You think by the time she hit adulthood she hadn’t added some more pebbles, rocks, boulders. And then she might have a backpack that was bursting at the seams, but now she’s an adult. Well, guess what? She’s 30 years old now, and she’s got some other ones that she’s now contending with. These include she has a friend that ended her life by suicide her freshman year. She had a falling out with her sister, her only remaining sibling. And so they’re estranged. She got married, her first pregnancy ended in miscarriage three years into the marriage. Her husband is addicted to meth. She’s 30 years old and she’s carrying all of that pain.

Here’s what I do. And this is getting to answer your question is so as I, and I’m sharing a story with you that, I’m it’s, it’s fictitious in some respects, but I’m actually putting together a lot of stories of people I’ve worked with. Here’s what happens I might’ve started working with them and helping them discover what their purposes and what they’re here for. They came in, their business people,they’re working on stuff and I do life story. They have mastered the use of busyness, you know, to run, and they were told, just stay busy and over time it’ll get better. We do get some distance from that pain, but it is preserved in the body. Like frozen in time.

Here’s what happened. And this is gets back to how did this grief part of my business come about? Well, there’s many reasons. But what I’m going to just real specifically say is that in my work with people, and I was going through their stories, I was finding more and more and more that there’s all these unhealed losses. And I’m thinking, you know what, we can move through my program and get to their vision, purpose, mission, and who they’re here to be. But as long as they’re carrying all the weight of that pain, there is a belief they’re not lovable, valuable, worthwhile, enough, and safe. If we don’t address the root of that, they’re going to stay stuck and never get to where they choose to be.

I discovered the Grief Recovery Method in 2023. Quite honestly, I’d already been doing grief work for many years first as a psychologist, but then, I’d gone through cancer of my own. So I worked with cancer patients along the way. Ultimately, I came across the Grief Recovery Method a year and a half ago. I went through the method for my own pain. I lost both of my parents in 2021 when they died during COVID. It was a pain unlike any other. I had lost my oldest sister as a child. I was no stranger to death.

Teresa: I was reading your book, this little book that you have, Abundant Hope. You have walked through a lot of loss and a lot of pain yourself.

Dr. Richelle: I had, and I think the Grief Recovery Method, after my parents died, I used the STERB of my business again. I started, the relapsing started happening, it wasn’t quite to the depth that it was, but it was a way to avoid those hard feelings of walking life without my parents. I found the Grief Recovery Method and thought, “What is this?” I read the book called the Grief Recovery Handbook. I reached out to the Institute and found out that there’s training to be a specialist. I thought, “Oh, this is right up my alley. I love helping people with their emotions.”

I became a specialist, but in order to become a specialist, I had to go through the method on myself. Oh my goodness, Teresa. It was so life transforming. I got to the root of things I didn’t have any clue I had been carrying. And here’s the beautiful part; it’s not therapy. It doesn’t take forever. It’s not like you’re going to rehearse the story over and over again. We’ve all done that and we don’t feel any better. So here’s what the method does. It’s a short term action program. It’s evidence based program that walks people step by step, essentially eight steps to emotional freedom and recovery from grief.

Now, as I say that I don’t mean to say that we ever get over losing them. That is not what I’m saying. What I am saying, though, is you empty out the backpack of the weight that is frozen in your body because your emotions, energy and motion are trapped in your body. And it leads to health issues. It leads to mental health issues. And I’m going to say, because I am a mental health professional, that I believe probably 90%, and I’m making up the number, but I believe it’s a lot of the mental health issues, the root, is unresolved grief, the traumas that people have encountered.

Teresa: I would agree with you, and I can only say that through my own story and through my own experience, both mentally and physically, as we walked for 15 years and a lot of trauma, I would not have called it that then, because you just are putting one foot in front of the other, but a lot of the trauma around our son’s story with addiction and his difficulty as a child, I didn’t realize how much I was carrying in my body. Cortisol levels, all the physical things that are going on, autoimmune things, different things. Then on the other side of that, and also anytime you walk in long-term backpack weight that you’re talking about, you develop patterns of behavior. Your brain can rewire around things, rewire your emotions of how you respond and handle. I truly believe this healing work you’re talking about doesn’t make the lot go away. It’s how do I carry it differently?

Dr. Richelle: This method is about getting complete on emotions that were unaddressed at the time of some of our woundings, whether it be in a relationship, because usually even with a death, like in my case, when I’m walking through recovering from the loss of my mom, I had to deal with some things that hadn’t been dealt with in the history of our relationship. I got complete on something.

So what we do in the method is we get clear on some of the emotions that we didn’t even know we had. So we label them, discover them, and learn how to communicate and deliver them. When you’re doing that with someone who’s here to now witness your grief, this is work you cannot do alone. You need someone to witness that.

Teresa: That’s the other beautiful piece that I love about the work that I hear that you’re doing. It is work in community, even if that community is you and one other person. And I believe that God designed us to do life to one another. So you using your talents, gifts, your desire for learning, your desire to walk it out in your own story, thank you for this work that you’re doing that I know is life changing. If you’re listening, you can hear how passionate Dr. Rochelle is about this, which is right up my alley. I love people that are super passionate. This is a program that she has, to help people find their abundant life and their purpose, but along the way, there’s also some of this grief and loss work that’s so important for people to get clear to that place.

She also just recently got certified in our REALIFE Process, and it’s been so fun to see her even incorporate the Rule of Life, REALIFE Process work in with this, and she has shared many times that she goes, I have the pieces now of all the things that I can walk people through and walk with.

So Richelle, I know people are going to be excited to hear more about your work and they’re going to need to find you. They’re going to need to connect with you. I know they are. Where is the best place for us to connect with you and just learn more about the work that you’re doing?

Dr. Richelle: I would be thrilled to connect with more people just to share my passion for living life more abundantly. So there’s two places I would direct people to. If you’re on Facebook, search for Abundant Mindset with Dr. Richelle. My name is spelled R I C H E L L E. And what I do there is regularly post inspiration, encouragement, and practical tips on how to live life purposefully, and embodying all of the things you and I most value. It’s a community of people

So the other place that I would just encourage you to go to my website, which is again DRRICHELLE.COM. I want to point people to a free download of my first mini book with Zig Ziglar’s son, who is a motivational speaker, his son, Tom Ziglar, I wrote the book Road Trip with him that really shares kind of my story of going from grind to grace in that, but also in the context of getting clear on what your purpose is. So it’s a great entry point for people to start asking themselves some questions of where am I? Am I clear on these things? Do I need a map? And so that would be a free download.

But as you mentioned, and I thank you for sharing that, I had shared with you my most recent, passion project, which was writing out my story of my journey through grief and loss. I call it Abundant Hope, a book that is really not only my story, but what has helped me to rise above the pain of the losses I’ve encountered over the course of my life. Some of my faith pieces, my story, my testimony, but also, pointing you to possibly even connecting with me over the Grief Recovery Method, if that’s something you’re interested in. And I do a lot of my coaching through Zoom appointments. So location isn’t, a barrier. If you’re interested in the book, I have a place on the website that you can order that book for a small fee.

Teresa: It’s a great little book. I have actually read through it twice now, right hen you sent it to me and then I read through it again this past week. So when I mean little, it’s little.

Dr. Richelle: It’s a little less than an hour.

Teresa: Stick it in your purse to get, you know, in your briefcase, whatever, and read it very quickly. Very inspirational. So I love this great little gift I’ve thought about having some of these on hand for people that I know are going through grief and loss just to say, “Oh, there’s someone that would understand my story.” And you’re very transparent in this little book and in all the work that you do to share your story and just appreciate you so much, friend. I just love the connection that we’ve gotten to make over the last few months. The work that you’re doing, helping those because I am one of those people that I learned a new term today of STERB and I know exactly what those are for me and, how I can use those to do the avoidance, to keep me from doing the deeper work that God might be inviting me to in healing. Thank you for walking with people in that way and your talents and your gifts. It’s been a joy.

I was sitting here thinking this will not be the only podcast episode we have you on because you are an expert in your field and in what you do. I can’t wait to have you back again, for more of these conversations, thank you for your time today.

Dr. Richelle: Well, I’m greatly honored and thank you for the invitation today.